Ken Snow and the IICRC

[Mikey P]

Ken


Lets go beyond the "what can the IICRC do for me" argument and talk about what you feel our industry needs to provide further education.

• What kind of schooling should there be for a new guy entering the trade?
  Are you totally against accreditation?
  Should large companies such as Hagopian and the franchises be allowed to have in house IICRC classes that are "dumbed" down?
  Classes with no testing?
  How do you train your guys presently?

In your perfect little purple would what would you like to see in regards to educating and policing our industry?

 

[XTREME1]

My personal opinion is that is how it should be set up

What kind of schooling should there be for a new guy entering the trade? Enough to know not to harm carpets and to get the basics done
Are you totally against accreditation? I would say levels of accreditation so that if a 10 year old can be certified that it would be more complex to become a master
Should large companies such as Hagopian and the franchises be allowed to have in house IICRC classes that are "dumbed" down? for the first level sure, it is already dumbed down but if someone wanted to be a journeyman or master he would have to train and test at another facility
Classes with no testing? for uncertified
How do you train your guys presently? he sends them to massachusetts and pays me to train them


Ken Snow on Greg Crowleys computer

 

[Mikey P]

I'll assume Marty is doing his job and your name is not Ken.

 

[XTREME1]

Mikey have you ever seen myself and Ken Snow in the same room?

 

[Ken Snow]

For the record, I have no problem with the existence of an educational body and think that it can have a great benefit to new people and even small operators who want to send their people somewhere to have a new tech trained in some basics of fiber construction as well as the specialty areas. I also have no problem with certification within certain specialty areas such as water and fire restoration and possibly marble flooring. I do not think that “Certification” is necc for carpet cleaning and that the whole certification gig is a program to make the certifiers more money and gives virtually no value, in its present state, to the cleaners, the consumers etc. Carpet cleaning is hard work, no doubt, but it is not technically difficult to do or train to do in my opinion.

Ken
Ps I could spend more time writing more about my opinions on this but as I said the IICRC doesn't enter my thought proccess much, nor do I think it has any bearing, currently, on consumers choices, nor need to. To me it is about giving the customer what they want and making cheerleaders, not having some card worth the paper its printed on~ which by the way can take months to get after passing a test (talk about absurd in this day and age). With technology it seems that tested students should be able to leave the class with updated cards if they passed.

 

[Larry B]

Ken Snow is the man



Agree with you 110%

 

[Mikey P]

So would you suggest they do away with testing/certifying and lower the cost of the education?

and make classes available online?

 

[Scott]

Ken - That's a great reply. The big names in our industry don't generally use IICRC as a stepladder because they already have their own set of standards and training systems in place. There's absolutely no need for them to re-invent the wheel.

Ken's company developed their own standards and systems well before IICRC was ever conceived. To fix something that isn't broken would be a huge mistake, as Ken alluded.

 

[bob vawter]

HEEEEEY..!!!!!
How come Ken's the man...HUH?

we BOTH run emulsifiers thru our machines the exact same way...and charge purty much the same......and neither one of us vacuums....

so

why can't I be the man....TOO?

 

[Larry B]

Because the term "Old Man" isn't politically correct

 

[Brian R]

You da man bob!

Where's that eye rolling emoticon?


Oh there it is.

:roll:

 

[Ken Snow]

LOL- I thik there are probably way more differences in our ops than similarities Bob, but you are the man in my eyes.

Thanks Sott for your comments, but don't think that is gonna stop me from wanting to help outfit you in a new metro look :-)

Mike- I don't think it matters too much what I think as there is too much money to be made by the iicrc in its present structure. I do think online and in-house training, bith things that the Pemberton's have been preaching to deaf ears is long overdue.

What may be happening is the internet & bulletin boards specifically may render the iicrc obsolete.

Ken

 

[bob vawter]

Ken...we'll has some sliders one day at the Hunter House......and i'll tell ALL my secrets....

well most anyway!

 

[XTREME1]

 

[Loren Egland]

Keeping up my IICRC Master status is just one of many little marketing USP's to set me apart so I can get more money for my work. Doesn't do squat as far as cleaning the carpet though. It is just a (small) marketing expense for me.

I did get a job last week because I had credentials. The lady found our website, I think through CRI, and read these things on our website http://www.deltasteamway.com .

 

[Mikey P]

What may be happening is the internet & bulletin boards specifically may render the iicrc obsolete.

You mean just like the slow death of the Associations?

I got this email from CFI today.

Would would possibly make we want to join?

Message from Our President

December, 2008


After reading through old issues of Western Carpet Cleaner and Western Cleantalk, I cant help but be again reminded of how much CFI has grown and changed since Gene and George Janssen , whom I've never met, founded the Rug Cleaners Institute back in 1952.. I've heard stories about how Gene invested great time and energy into convincing area cleaners that if they united as a group they could learn from each other and share common ground.
As a CFI member and a former Los Angeles chapter director I know Gene was right from first hand experience. I recall how excited I was to hold my very first CFI chapter meeting. (No, not the one at the sewage plant) I think it was a BBQ, and boy did we have a great turn out! Our members really enjoy sharing stories about the crazy client, the browned out sofa that turned purple, and all the lost things you find when blocking and chipping. Even better is talking shop and sharing ideas about new products and the latest gossip from around the industry. As far as I'm concerned, that's all good stuff, but for me, the best is being reminded that we are all in this together, and for the past 60 years, CFI members have pretty much seen it all, together.
CFI has opened many doors of opportunity for me as a professional and as a person. And through the power of association, those who used to be my most feared competition are now my best allies and some, even friends. And having friends in this business really helps when times get tough or you just need to someone who understands the challenges that our line of work brings on a daily basis. I am truly grateful for this association and all it has done for me.
I am proud to announce that this year, CFI will host a variety of IICRC training courses, local chapter meetings, regional education days and charity events. None of this would be possible without our board of directors, who I believe are a great team to work with. And since this association has always been about teamwork, I would like to invite anyone who would like to get involved, start a CFI chapter or host meetings or events to please contact me personally at 1-818-515-7841.

Happy New Year!

Sincerely,
Matthew Sanders
President, Carpet and Fabricare Institute.
P.O. Box 758
Escondido, CA 92033
1-800-Carpet9
www.carpet9.org

 

[Jim Bethel]

LOL- I thik there are probably way more differences in our ops than similarities Bob, but you are the man in my eyes.

I think that was the nicest "I think your dreaming ol' man" reply I think I have read.

 

[Ken Snow]

I've learned to be tactful in my 30 year career Jim :-)

I really do find Bob to be intelligent, articulate when he chooses to be, and very knowledgeable about the cleaning bus. He also, like I try, doesn't take himself too seriously and he doesn't shy away from confrontation or adversity- something I admire a lot. He may be a crasy old coot, but I am glad to have gotten to know him via these boards and perhaps one day in person, esp since our bus are only 15 or so miles apart and we live even closer.

Ken

 

[Larry B]

since our bus are only 15 or so miles apart and we live even closer.

Ken

I'll bet you have trouble sleeping at night

 

[Bruce Humphrey]

Ken wee can give Bob a surprise visit one of these days , we'll just stop in and see him.

 

[Brian R]

Don't trip over the empty beer bottles and look out for any gun barrels sticking out windows.

 

[bob vawter]

Gary Roland did that las summer.....i almost shot the fool.......

 

[Brian R]

See

 

[Bruce Humphrey]

:shock:

 

[Ken Snow]

Sounds like a great idea Bruce, or maybe you meet me and Bawb for some sliders in b'ham.

 

[steve r]

lol this is the best post ive read today .

 

[renegade_cowboy]

Just to let everyone know what one of the big companies do. I worked for SS 4-5 years ago and what they had was Stanley Steemer University. Basically Chris Taylor got certified to become a IICRC trainer. He created SS University which is basically the same as the IICRC classes. When I was there they had carpet, uph and sales certification classes. You did get a certification and a laminated card just like the IICRC. Now he did do the hands on training he sent his certified SSU employees out to all the branches once a year or so to do the SSU training. I took both IICRC and SSU classes and everything is pretty much the same.

The classes did alot of great for the employees there, the quality and understanding of carpet cleaning went up and the techs were excited to clean carpets. Sales went through the roof.

The problem is that they have a high turn over rate cause they work their employees to death. I have seen a helper go to crew cheif in under a month.

That is how SS rolls they basically train their own techs and make their own TM and give the finger to the industry. SS does have a streamline operation that a retarded monkey can learn quickly.

Something else that was funny was they claim to do background checks but they hire people who dont pass. I worked with a helper that just got out of prison after 6 years for burglary. He broke into strip malls through the venting system, got caught at a doughnut shop, how funny is that.


How about if you want a license to own a carpet cleaning business you have to present a certification to the state. Other than that there will always be the hacks out there, but they usually 86 themself out of the industry.

 

[Ken Snow]

Brent- that is good info to hear. If SS did hire people with felony convictions after running checks they may not have run the proper ones or deep enough. There are checks that cover county, state, all states & federal and if you don't run them all something can be missed i.e. a guy commits a state felony in Illinois, then moves to Michigan, a check that does not include multistate inquiry will not show anything.

Ken

 

[Dolly Llama]

How about if you want a license to own a carpet cleaning business you have to present a certification to the state. Other than that there will always be the hacks out there, but they usually 86 themself out of the industry.

NO!

That won't do a thing to rid the biz of hacks or hucksters.
All it will do is add more regulation.....eff that!

a 10 year old can pass the cert test without ever having a wand in his/her hand

certified schmertified, I much rather have a conscientious, experienced service provider than a "book smart" one year wonder with an arm full of patches.

I know we all like to think we're "tradesmen" like electricians, plumbers and carpenters, but the reality is, the VAST majority of us are little more than well paid glorified janitors or an extension of the "house keeping" staff.

I say "vast majority" and not "all" cause there are some peeps who can specialize in investment grade rug restoration and repair.
Those folks might qualify as "tradesmen/craftsmen" to me
But you don't get that knowledge from a 2 day cert class.......that a 10 year old with NO experience can pass


...L.T.A.

 

[Mikey P]

So meAt, when are you getting your Janitor tattoo?